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Censorship 
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Post Re: Censorship
OK, back to the topic on hand -- censorship.

An open letter to Bill Ryan of Project Avalon:

I read your explanation about banning people in the “Banning for misalignment” thread. Normally, the voices you silence cannot provide a rebuttal to your smooth but flawed arguments. I would like to remedy that “oversight”.

Your primary argument for justifying the ban hammer is this classic line:

Quote:
If we'd known [... fill in this gap with anything you like ...] about this person when they first applied -- would we have invited them?

If the answer is No - then they are often uninvited. We're just correcting our error.

It's that simple. Nothing really to do with forum guidelines. It's to do with considering their application retrospectively.


No, it’s not as simple as you claim, Bill. Suppose we fill in the gap like this:

"If we'd known Chicodoodoo would eventually expose our unwarranted censoring of truths that might implicate us in unethical behavior that we wish to keep hidden -- would we have invited him?"

Of course, you would never invite such a person, not even to a forum that claims to support truth-seekers. But you did. Whoops.

And until the unwarranted censorship was questioned, you were quite satisfied with your choice. You even expressed your satisfaction for Chicodoodoo’s comportment publicly in your misnamed “Integrity” thread where you hoped to head off any criticism about some other unjustified bannings that were recently on your hands.

Quote:
Certainly nothing to do with nation-states or constitutions. This is not a public place. It's a private gathering, by invitation only. JFK's admirable rhetoric does not apply.


Yes, it’s best from your perspective to keep high moral standards and ethics out of the argument.

Quote:
If you don't like this restaurant, just go and find another one. It's cool. If you hate the place (or its owner), why did you come here anyway?


What if you don’t hate the place, or its owner? Many blacks in the South faced the same dilemma. They mistakenly thought they had the right to frequent any restaurant of their choosing, like other free persons. The racists, however, disagreed.

Yes, a restaurant is private property, but it serves the public. Just like Avalon.

Quote:
Moreover, if you look like you're going to wreck the joint when all we want to do is provide our guests with some wonderful nourishment, then we may throw you out. And we have the right to do that. Period.


That depends on how you define “wreck the joint”, doesn’t it. The racists considered the joint wrecked as soon as the blacks walked in the door.

Now, I’m not implying that you are a racist. I am saying that you are a censor, one that censors not just to police Avalon, but for personal reasons that aren’t quite ethical.

Quote:
It's about whether, if we'd had the gift of precognition when you applied, would we have accepted you.

And we leave you with that question to ponder. It's really about intentions.


Overall, a very smooth but deceptive argument, Bill. Yes, I pondered the question. Yes, it’s about intentions. But what counts is whose intentions, and what intentions. What might be your intentions when you ban someone for asking questions about things you would prefer remain hidden, things that might serve the common good if they were known, but at your own personal expense?

It’s a classic case of conflict of interest. You should recluse yourself, Bill.

Chicodoodoo

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Thu May 19, 2011 5:25 pm
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Chico your the Man.
I watched the Avalon 1 forum ban Thuban, then I watched Camelot ban Thuban and me, then i watched Avalon 2 ban you. LoL all in the name of oneness, love and god. And they werent real hot topics either. Like sex or drugs. The slave planet dynamics is in everything. And the PTB are super sneaky. Like they plan something 50 a 100 years in advance. I bet you anything they way our sex dynamics and drug dynamics are just how they planned it to be. Thats why their so fucking arrogant cause everything is working for them. I think the Avalon 2 banning was a great stand in integrity. Its interesting how Atticus left Nexus, thats because he had too. We rip into that guy and turn him to swiss cheese. Then his whole second coming bluebeem bull shit would have gone bust. Fucking losers. I like how Avalon has those real high IQ fucks who could turn a shit sandwich into a tuna melt and make you thank them in the process. Im just venting but its fun to talk smack...Were all human but its time to draw the line. The truth is getting so obvious lately I dont even have to work hard to get it. Fucking stupid MD's and Lawyers. I mean is there anyone more fucked? Those guys are so far up their ass there looking through their ass. You have to micromanage everything in this world to get it done your way. The bureaucracy is falling apart. The damn systems joints are loosening and everyone knows it. Everything is a Ponzie scheme. To big to fail so there going down with the ship. You have to judge and act and get out of the way. And while these idiots are falling down give some of them a weight to easy their suffering. They are using the protection of this system to defend themselves. So i dont feel bad not saying anything. Motherfuckers would have me fired, ridiculed or imprisoned in a heart beat. Empty headed psychopaths. Now listen if there ever was a road map of the Galaxy. The book would worn you that earth is a Psychopathic breeding ground "Stop,do not pass Go, do not collect 2OO $"

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Thu May 19, 2011 7:23 pm
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Magamud, with crude language like that, are you trying to get banned? :shock:

Just kidding about the banning, but I do prefer language with more elegance. You have uncovered one of my weaknesses. I often say that if we can't control what comes out of our mouths, what can we control?

That seems appropriate to discuss in a thread about censorship. By carefully selecting our own words, we alleviate the need for censorship. "Says who?!" Yep, and therein lies the problem of censorship.

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Fri May 20, 2011 6:52 pm
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I hear ya Chico, and maybe one of the reasons were in such a predicament is that we have given our language to such a decorum as law and politicians. They have hijacked it and if someone swears they are ostracized. Paraphrasing i heard a great quote from a founding father in that if speech from the common man is not heard or a priority we are lost. My dead grandmother also left me with a saying when she was dying with alzheimer's. She use to say fuck all the time and when I asked why she told me, what other word could express such feeling. Now since we are becoming aware of this total enslavement grid this type of language should be allowed to express such feeling. Now with language going into sex and what i did or how i did or would like to do with someone is another topic in itself. I would submit are idea of sex and bad language as off limits is old world thinking. But i get the balance :mrgreen:

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Fri May 20, 2011 9:39 pm
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censorship takes deeper levels. It is like bacteria and antibiotics. Or is it like fusion. Is the idea of human moderation ridiculous? Is it true what B Fraknlin said that either man will be ruled by Tyranny or God? If god is energetic a visceral feeling with out due tangibility we sure are in a funk of things. How will one vision the Holy Ghost, syncronicity or coincidence. Its more of balancing the dream world with the hard neutonian physic world. It portends to understanding the grand design. Is not our reality an exhibit of a vision gone wrong?
If I was an administer I would first recluse myself for being human often, let the people reign and have faith in the Great Plan...

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Sat May 21, 2011 12:57 am
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I actually find swearing to be a poor purveyor of meaning. There are so many words with such precision of meaning that could be selected, yet too many people fall back on swear words that simply let the listener assign their own meaning to the idea being communicated. It's lazy, vague, and hardly qualifies as helpful communication. You could say, "You blankety blank blank blankety blank, get to your blankety blank blank work." Or you could simply say, "Get to work." When it comes to communication, small, fast, and efficient has always been my preference.

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Sat May 21, 2011 4:11 am
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Post Re: Censorship
Chicodoodoo wrote:
OK, back to the topic on hand -- censorship.

An open letter to Bill Ryan of Project Avalon:

I read your explanation about banning people in the “Banning for misalignment” thread. Normally, the voices you silence cannot provide a rebuttal to your smooth but flawed arguments. I would like to remedy that “oversight”.

Your primary argument for justifying the ban hammer is this classic line:

Quote:
If we'd known [... fill in this gap with anything you like ...] about this person when they first applied -- would we have invited them?

If the answer is No - then they are often uninvited. We're just correcting our error.

It's that simple. Nothing really to do with forum guidelines. It's to do with considering their application retrospectively.


No, it’s not as simple as you claim, Bill. Suppose we fill in the gap like this:

"If we'd known Chicodoodoo would eventually expose our unwarranted censoring of truths that might implicate us in unethical behavior that we wish to keep hidden -- would we have invited him?"

Of course, you would never invite such a person, not even to a forum that claims to support truth-seekers. But you did. Whoops.

And until the unwarranted censorship was questioned, you were quite satisfied with your choice. You even expressed your satisfaction for Chicodoodoo’s comportment publicly in your misnamed “Integrity” thread where you hoped to head off any criticism about some other unjustified bannings that were recently on your hands.

Quote:
Certainly nothing to do with nation-states or constitutions. This is not a public place. It's a private gathering, by invitation only. JFK's admirable rhetoric does not apply.


Yes, it’s best from your perspective to keep high moral standards and ethics out of the argument.

Quote:
If you don't like this restaurant, just go and find another one. It's cool. If you hate the place (or its owner), why did you come here anyway?


What if you don’t hate the place, or its owner? Many blacks in the South faced the same dilemma. They mistakenly thought they had the right to frequent any restaurant of their choosing, like other free persons. The racists, however, disagreed.

Yes, a restaurant is private property, but it serves the public. Just like Avalon.

Quote:
Moreover, if you look like you're going to wreck the joint when all we want to do is provide our guests with some wonderful nourishment, then we may throw you out. And we have the right to do that. Period.


That depends on how you define “wreck the joint”, doesn’t it. The racists considered the joint wrecked as soon as the blacks walked in the door.

Now, I’m not implying that you are a racist. I am saying that you are a censor, one that censors not just to police Avalon, but for personal reasons that aren’t quite ethical.

Quote:
It's about whether, if we'd had the gift of precognition when you applied, would we have accepted you.

And we leave you with that question to ponder. It's really about intentions.


Overall, a very smooth but deceptive argument, Bill. Yes, I pondered the question. Yes, it’s about intentions. But what counts is whose intentions, and what intentions. What might be your intentions when you ban someone for asking questions about things you would prefer remain hidden, things that might serve the common good if they were known, but at your own personal expense?

It’s a classic case of conflict of interest. You should recluse yourself, Bill.

Chicodoodoo


Hey Chico, why still putting so much time and energy in this. Look up man, the sun is shining bright today (at least here in France) :D


Sat May 21, 2011 5:37 am
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Post Re: Censorship
skippy wrote:
Hey Chico, why still putting so much time and energy in this. Look up man, the sun is shining bright today (at least here in France) :D


I remember living in France (Chambery and Besancon). Those relatively rare sunny days were so appreciated!

The reason I put time and energy into the censorship problem at Avalon is not for me personally. I get nothing out of it. In fact, I pay the price. I do it to help secure the right of free speech for those that come after me.

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Sun May 22, 2011 3:25 pm
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I cannot see how anyone can accept any further Governmenta Censorship. This is atrocious to me.

We should be going the opposite way and remove regulation, over sight and entanglement.

We accept Internet censorship laws to stop Trolls? Really?

You cannot handle it on your own? We have to own up to the Corrupted world we live in and deal with it!

Let me put it to you this way. Every man/woman should be able to defend their house and being. We don't need all these police to do this. We don't need all these laws to behave.

The Monarchs are mocking us as we accept more laws and interference. We must grow up!

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Wed Jun 13, 2012 3:43 am
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Post Re: Censorship
magamud wrote:
I cannot see how anyone can accept any further Governmenta Censorship. This is atrocious to me.

And to me. There are three kinds of people. You and I are the human kind, the non-sociopath. We recognize the wisdom of nature, where all information is freely available, and where transparency reigns with proper observation.

Quote:
We should be going the opposite way and remove regulation, over sight and entanglement.

Precisely, but all of that is the goal and raison d'etre of the sociopath.

Quote:
We accept Internet censorship laws to stop Trolls? Really?

Deception and manipulation is the way of the sociopath.

Quote:
We have to own up to the Corrupted world we live in and deal with it!

We don't need all these laws to behave.

We must grow up!

I couldn't agree more.

P.S. What a blast from the past! I wish Skippy were still here. Thanks for directing us to look at this again, Magamud.

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It's not that we can't handle the truth. It's that they can't handle us if we know the truth.


Wed Jun 13, 2012 6:20 pm
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