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Sociopaths -- who knew? 
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Post Re: Sociopaths -- who knew?
magamud wrote:
Basically the contrast is in the state of slavery we are in. I said we have a gun to our heads, you think the state is based on conditions or choice.

I understand why you say we have a gun to our head, because the methods used against us are so effective. Those methods are primarily those of a con-artist, i.e. deception and manipulation. Con-artists typically don't hold a gun to your head. Their methods are more refined but still bring about similar results -- you end up being separated from your valuables.

magamud wrote:
You put your foundation on this by stating a sliding scale of supposed progress one is making in "freeing oneself".

I was actually speaking in general terms about seeing situations in shades of gray versus seeing them in black and white.

magamud wrote:
I will give more context to my "gun to the head". When I say that, I am mean we are hostages, therefore anything the system asks, is a threat! You call this place a matrix and if so, what is not being threatened?

Not everything the system asks is a threat. That's black and white thinking, and things are more complicated than that. For example, the system "asks" that we watch TV so that we better succumb to the brainwashing. I eventually figured this out, so I quit watching TV. This is a choice any of us can make. There is no gun to our heads forcing us to watch TV. Yet watching TV is something the controllers of the world very much want us to do, and they get us to do it by a variety of very effective methods, none of which require the threat of force.

magamud wrote:
Perhaps your an optimist?

Did you notice that this too is black and white thinking? Your question is an example of our programming in action! Optimist or pessimist? Coke or Pepsi? Boxers or briefs? Obama or McCain? I don't see only two choices. I see an infinite range of possibilities between the two extremes, like the extremes of optimist and pessimist. But note how many of the "choices" we are offered are not even two extremes, but essentially the same thing. This is an essential trick of the con-artists. Coke is basically the same thing as Pepsi. Same for boxers and briefs. And surprise, surprise, it's the same for the choice between Obama and McCain. So there isn't really a choice being offered, and you describe it as a hostage situation where there is essentially a gun to our head. But I say that is inaccurate. We could vote for Ron Paul, or Chicodoodoo, or Magamud. We are free to do so. But most of us won't do it because the controllers have us believing in the deceptive choices they offer us.

magamud wrote:
The buzzword "Conspiracy Theorist" is another thing to behold. That word is as if its a prompt to a conditioned program to carry outs its mind controlled outcome.

Yes, I mentioned that as well in this post. It's like Pavlovian conditioning, or more properly, operant conditioning.

magamud wrote:
Would you subject children to this matrix? Can you stop the radiation from poisoning your biology? Can you even stop the water from poisoning your biology? Food? Is that Air you are breathing? Can any organization actually listen to an individual?

Yes, on occasion, organizations do listen to an individual.

"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has." -- Margaret Mead

As for subjecting children to this Matrix, let me share with you a text conversation I recently had with my daughter, who is considering bringing children into this world but was feeling a bit "blue".

Quote:
Daughter: How do you deal with this world? I can't, it's just too depressing.

Father: Well, there are two sides to every coin.

Can't see the other side.

What is depressing you?

The state of the world. People are suffering. Sociopaths are ruling the world. I am not supposed to be here. I feel too much.

There is evil running rampant, I know. Perhaps we are here to diminish it.

I had to disconnect with some of my abilities as a child because they are too painful. Sensing death. Feeling other people's emotions. Why does nobody else feel these things?

There is no diminishing. History just repeats itself over and over again except now on a massive earth-destroying scale.


You have a lot of empathy. This is an advantage and a disadvantage, like all things.

I see it as a good thing, but under these conditions, it is tough.


We have to keep ourselves distracted to try and not be overwhelmed by the horrific reality of all of this. I want less empathy right about now.

Understandable.

I just don't feel like I deserve to ever be happy because other people are suffering. I feel guilty any time I am. And then I suffer like this, I suppose.

Hmmm....

I can't save the world, so I am useless. What does it matter what I do for my students? We all just become wheels perpetuating the machine.

Empathy allows you to put yourself in another's emotional shoes, but you aren't actually forced to do that.

Teachers never realize the extent of their influence on their students. They can't. Nevertheless, it is there.

Not all of your students will become wheels in the machine. Some may not precisely because of you. But we can't know how the future will play out.

None of us can save the world. That doesn't make us useless.

All of us contribute to this world. That can make us useful.

Little things count. They always have.


Ok, well those are good words for affirmations. Those seem to help me sometimes. I think, though, I had better just go to bed now.

I love you Dad. Thanks.

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Sun May 17, 2015 5:17 am
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Post Re: Sociopaths -- who knew?
Thats a very nice letter and with that I'm not sure I want to argue on the level of slavery with you. You missed a lot of deep points in the thread and its because you feel you still have choice. The best you can do is accept the technocracy and do what you must. You already have a family, so you are tied to it. I do not. This is a huge advantage in relation to the matrix. You conceptualizing me in this polarity is disingenuous and I say that because you have missed the deeper points and instead of going there, you use your sense of freedom as a means to an end.

Quote:
Did you notice that this too is black and white thinking?

Actually I was throwing out a reference to get you in a banter to distill our logos. You thought it was a trap and then gave your reasons for it. Good reasons I must say, but not the truth and everything about the truth. You missed the whole gateway of how sociopaths use the technique of positive thinking and optimist to propel the matrix.

Quote:
Yes, on occasion, organizations do listen to an individual.

I think you are being very naive. Can you mention one in some civic capacity. I would argue in even more detail, that the family unit can't organize, less someones mind. That is the real reason why the family unit was attacked so much in the last century. To break up the family unit. Which it has done in spades. Thinking you can individually overcome this monolithic con job in even that capacity is audacious.

Quote:
"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has." -- Margaret Mead


This is a con and used in your context would always produce a patsy, a never ending loop, which I will not choose to participate. Let me put it to you this way, you must come to my conclusion and then recycle all your proverbial remarks on "liberty" etc... And I'm not telling you what to do. I am trying to help you....

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Sun May 17, 2015 6:35 am
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Post Re: Sociopaths -- who knew?
magamud wrote:
Thats a very nice letter and with that I'm not sure I want to argue on the level of slavery with you.

I agree there are plenty of levels of slavery to go around. They are mostly subtle, however, not like the Southern plantation slavery we read about. Mind control is a big factor, and that changes the perception of slavery. The more you are mind-controlled, the less you can perceive your slavery.

magamud wrote:
You missed a lot of deep points in the thread and its because you feel you still have choice.

Did I miss your deep points? Bring them up again, and illustrate them with examples. I thought I addressed your points with examples showing how they aren't entirely accurate.

magamud wrote:
You already have a family, so you are tied to it. I do not. This is a huge advantage in relation to the matrix. You conceptualizing me in this polarity is disingenuous and I say that because you have missed the deeper points and instead of going there, you use your sense of freedom as a means to an end.

I think you have a wrong impression of my message. It was not targeted to you personally, or to me personally. I am trying to illustrate broader, universal concepts, like the feeling of futility in the face of the forces of domination. I feel you expressing that futility, much like my daughter also expressed it in her own way.

You are more often analyzing me as the messenger rather than analyzing my message. Look more deeply at the message.

magamud wrote:
Actually I was throwing out a reference to get you in a banter to distill our logos. You thought it was a trap and then gave your reasons for it.

No, I didn't think it was a trap on a personal level. I was showing how it is a trap set by the sociopaths, at the level of mind control. We all get caught up in their traps and almost never notice it. I just happened to notice it and write about it.

magamud wrote:
Good reasons I must say, but not the truth and everything about the truth. You missed the whole gateway of how sociopaths use the technique of positive thinking and optimist to propel the matrix.

Yes, they not only give us fake choices, as I illustrated, but they also use both optimism and pessimism to manipulate us. Patriotism is an example of optimism used to control us. Fear (WMDs) is an example of pessimism used to control us.

magamud wrote:
Chicodoodoo wrote:
Yes, on occasion, organizations do listen to an individual.

I think you are being very naive. Can you mention one in some civic capacity.

Well, yes! This is where sociopaths shine. I've seen our city attorney, a genuine sociopath, lead our City Council around by the nose. Individual generals (often sociopaths) lead their soldiers, and individual leaders lead their followers.

magamud wrote:
To break up the family unit. Which it has done in spades. Thinking you can individually overcome this monolithic con job in even that capacity is audacious.

Not so. That is another place where organizations (like a family) can listen to an individual. I agree the con job is too massive and pervasive to be overcome in an absolute sense, but it can be weakened, exposed, resisted, and whittled away little by little. And there's that expression of futility again -- "Thinking you can individually overcome this monolithic con job in even that capacity is audacious."

magamud wrote:
Quote:
"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has." -- Margaret Mead

This is a con and used in your context would always produce a patsy, a never ending loop, which I will not choose to participate.

Yes and no. It can be applied to support a con, or it can also support the truth. Look at sociopaths, "a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens" that have definitely changed the world. That sociopaths are evil, working in their best interests and against the majority of humanity's best interests does not detract from the truth of that quote.

magamud wrote:
Let me put it to you this way, you must come to my conclusion and then recycle all your proverbial remarks on "liberty" etc... And I'm not telling you what to do. I am trying to help you....

:lol: :lol: I must point out that the ruling sociopaths have the exact same perspective! And please don't take that as a personal attack. It is more an example of how the sociopaths successfully mold us in their image and get us to think like they do.

No, we must uncover the truth and come to our own conclusions. That is the essence of freedom. The sociopaths want to enslave us by hiding the truth and leading us to come to the conclusions they decide will best serve their interests. That is their game, a product of their deviant psychological makeup. Our game, based on empathy, is to maximize and distribute the blessings of life to all. Two very different games. The sociopaths are succeeding spectacularly, while the non-sociopaths are losing ground. At least, that's the way I'm seeing it...

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Sun May 17, 2015 7:21 pm
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Post Re: Sociopaths -- who knew?
I forgot how much work this place is :lol:

Quote:
The more you are mind-controlled, the less you can perceive your slavery.

Indeed

Quote:
Bring them up again, and illustrate them with examples.
I tried going back, but I found a better trail, which will lead to the same thing anyway. But...

Re reading your post, I think I found one of your reflexes. You tend to divert the narrative to identifying black and white thinking. Which I can understand, but I'm trying to triangulate position. It does not seem like we are on the same level. You then are trying to project sociopathy on me, in a reflex dynamic. Part of it, is because you think I'm in a futile position.

Quote:
It was not targeted to you personally, or to me personally.

I think your being disingenuous with trying to separate personal and social. They are both and the same. You do this to create a fake boundary to continue your assumption about me.

Code:
I am trying to illustrate broader, universal concepts,

With use of personal experience, how else can you communicate if not from personal experience.

Quote:
I feel you expressing that futility, much like my daughter also expressed it in her own way.

Its not futility, its the truth. You then associate me to your daughter. Do you see how subtle our minds can be?

Quote:
You are more often analyzing me as the messenger rather than analyzing my message. Look more deeply at the message.

This is irony...

Quote:
I was actually speaking in general terms about seeing situations in shades of gray versus seeing them in black and white.

You seem to be projecting a lot, with black and white thinking and removing the personal reference to it. This is a bit strange...

Quote:
Did you notice that this too is black and white thinking?


Ok back to topic...
Quote:
No, I didn't think it was a trap on a personal level. I was showing how it is a trap set by the sociopaths, at the level of mind control.


That was a response from my quote
Quote:
Actually I was throwing out a reference to get you in a banter to distill our logos. You thought it was a trap and then gave your reasons for it.


You are referencing my response as an example of how sociopaths set traps and then think I'm a victim of it. Hmmmm. You might be missing my analogies here. I often like to emphasize my ideas, especially when it comes to the matrix. Im getting more clinical as I get older and I can see how its beneficial when talking. Thanks for that!

Quote:
That is another place where organizations (like a family) can listen to an individual.

Again you are being very naive here. Im not saying its impossible, but the majority is tremendous. And to even hold some structure within the family dynamic, over time is incredibly hard to do. It has to do with type of conditioning. The family unit is obliterated and the only thing holding it together is TV. Im being dramatic, but its the truth.

Quote:
And there's that expression of futility again

You think my position is futile, but I do not. Its accepting the truth and doing that, It is a form of resistance You do not see it like me, you have miss calculated what is choice and what is programming. I don't know if i can help you, but You cannot overcome the problem in the same paradigm.

Let me tell you something. The reason we are in such a bad spot is because there is still a martyr complex. The martyr in the matrix continues the Con. The matrix loves the martyr. The matrix bets everything it has on the Martyr. The martyr saids, there is hope! But its not the hope I know of, it the hope that is used to fatten up the kill... Like a good parasite, a very evolved one, it lets its prey eat before it kills it.

We must stop this martyrdom in order to break free from this prison!

Quote:
That is the essence of freedom.

But taking help is one too. I think the big problem why people can't see the truth is because its so, so deep in the mind and part of the Con is to cover that up. If you give a reference point, it would change most people psyche completely, since they have never been there before. They of course, like most, will use a reflexive response and think they are being trapped or that they are losing their right to choose. They feel prayed upon.

I can tell you one thing, the Ego is incredibly deceptive.

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Mon May 18, 2015 8:25 pm
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Post Re: Sociopaths -- who knew?
magamud wrote:
I forgot how much work this place is :lol:

No kidding! The gulfs between what is meant, what is said, and what is understood are enormous. It's a wonder that any communication even takes place. This post of yours has me despairing that we will one day communicate clearly and effortlessly. But that difficulty in communicating is by design, as the Matrix is founded on "divide and rule".

magamud wrote:
Re reading your post, I think I found one of your reflexes. You tend to divert the narrative to identifying black and white thinking.

It's not a diversion, it's a necessity. If someone uses faulty reasoning, it is imperative to stop them as soon as possible and correct the error, before it leads to nonsense, which can happen rather quickly.

magamud wrote:
It does not seem like we are on the same level. You then are trying to project sociopathy on me, in a reflex dynamic. Part of it, is because you think I'm in a futile position.

At this point, I'm tearing my hair out wondering how you came to these conclusions. I'm definitely not trying to project sociopathy on you. If I thought you were a sociopath, you would have heard about it long ago. The mind control the sociopaths impose on us does entrain us to think the way the sociopaths want us to think. How we think about money is the classic example. The first few decades of my life were spent pursuing money exactly like the ruling sociopaths want, since money is the control structure they use to enslave us. You and I aren't sociopaths, yet we have many of their programs influencing our consciousness. So I don't need to project sociopathy on you, as the sociopaths have already done that to both of us.

And I don't think you are in a futile position. It is you who thinks humanity is in a futile position and can never escape. I disagree. I agree the situation appears very grim, but it's not over yet. I am reminded of the computer simulations Richard Dawkins talked about in The Selfish Gene chapter on game theory and the prisoner's dilemma. In one experiment, two groups were pitted against each other -- a very small group of sociopathic types (called hawks), and a large group of saintly types (called doves). The sociopaths tore up the saints nearly to the point of extinction, and then something unanticipated happened. The balance of power began to oscillate, cycling back and forth until a stable equilibrium was reached, eventually ending up very much like the starting conditions.

magamud wrote:
I think your being disingenuous with trying to separate personal and social. They are both and the same. You do this to create a fake boundary to continue your assumption about me.

They are not the same, there is no fake boundary, and I'm not making assumptions about you.

magamud wrote:
Its not futility, its the truth. You then associate me to your daughter. Do you see how subtle our minds can be?

No, I see how ridiculous our minds can be. The common thread with my daughter was her feeling of futility at having no chance against the system put together by the sociopaths, the same thing you've been emphasizing. That's the only association I had in mind between you two. Did you think I meant some other association?

magamud wrote:
You seem to be projecting a lot, with black and white thinking and removing the personal reference to it. This is a bit strange...

Maybe it's strange because it's not what I'm doing at all...

magamud wrote:
You are referencing my response as an example of how sociopaths set traps and then think I'm a victim of it. Hmmmm.

No, I am not thinking you per se are a victim of it. We are all at risk of falling for the many traps. These are the traps of mind control. We are born into the traps. The Matrix is the collection of traps. I'm talking in general and not about you or any other particular individual. It's frustrating to me that you keep taking it personally, when that is not at all my intent.

magamud wrote:
You think my position is futile, but I do not. Its accepting the truth and doing that, It is a form of resistance You do not see it like me, you have miss calculated what is choice and what is programming.

I don't think so. I pointed out how the choices being allowed (like Coke or Pepsi, etc.) are the underpinnings of the programming.

magamud wrote:
Let me tell you something. The reason we are in such a bad spot is because there is still a martyr complex. The martyr in the matrix continues the Con. The matrix loves the martyr.

The reason we are in such a bad spot is because there are organized sociopaths who created and maintain the Matrix for their benefit at our expense. Martyrs are not the root problem or even a significant problem. Focusing on martyrs is like focusing on that puzzling dilemma "Coke or Pepsi". Both sugary drinks are poisoning influences designed to distract our attention away from the real threats -- the Matrix and the architects of the Matrix!

magamud wrote:
I can tell you one thing, the Ego is incredibly deceptive.

That's because the environment it functions in (the Matrix) is incredibly deceptive.

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Tue May 19, 2015 5:26 am
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Quote:
Nature’s Not in It: Naked Juice Forced to Remove ‘All Natural’ From Labels

The Pepsi-owned brand was sued for false advertising and misleading labels.

The lawsuit, which was filed in the U.S. District Court for the Central District of California, alleged that Naked Juice couldn't call their products all natural because they contained Archer Daniels Midland's Fibersol-2 ("a soluble corn fiber that acts as a low-calorie bulking agent"), fructooligosaccharides (an alternative sweetener), and genetically modified soy.

Naked Juice laid the blame for the labeling confusion at the feet of the Feds, saying there's not enough "guidance" as to what can be called "natural." -- source

Oh, please... Not enough guidance on what constitutes 'natural'? Give me a break!

Here we have sociopaths in action, lying and cheating, they get caught, take no responsibility, feel no shame, and blame it on others and on word definitions! Where have we seen that before?




Same old story...

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Tue May 19, 2015 6:03 am
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Post Re: Sociopaths -- who knew?
Yes, so when sociopaths create organizations, or more likely infiltrate them, gaining the reins of power and control that steer the organization, the organizations themselves take on the characteristics of the sociopath. It is why businesses like Monsanto are so sociopathic. The same thing happens to governments.

Laura Knight-Jadczyk wrote:
For over 100 years now, the chief archetypal psychopath on the planet has been the United States; and the US is made up of psychopaths from all the previous "chief psychopaths" of other nations and Empires that have dominated at various times over the past 2000 years. The US psychopath is just bigger and worse than those that went before mainly because it has held sway during a period of history where such dominance can become global, particularly in our current 'high-tech' 'information age'. -- source

I would even venture to say that entire societies are affected, adopting the sociopathic tendencies encouraged by their sociopathic businesses and sociopathic government. That is why I say that sociopaths are molding us in their image.

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Mon May 25, 2015 9:49 pm
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According to Natasha Ezrow, a senior lecturer in the department of government at the University of Essex, most experts who study dictatorships start with a simple definition: “When there’s no turnover in power of the executive, then it’s a dictatorship,” she says. This means dictatorships could be built around an individual who has established a personality cult, a single governmental party or a military-run oligarchy. -- source

Or an organized group of cooperating sociopaths. By this definition, the United States is a dictatorship. The real power behind the Executive branch does not change with each new president. The same can be said for the Congress after each new election, or the the Court Justices after each new appointment by the President and the Congress. The window dressing changes, but the store behind the window stays basically the same.

Quote:
“The bad behaviour of dictators is not an inherent pathology of the people, or the bad luck of having psychopathic leaders,” Bueno de Mesquita says. “It’s because the political structure induces those behaviours.” -- source

No, the political structure does not induce those behaviors. The political structure is dominated by sociopaths, and they do everything they can to ensure that only sociopaths can be part of it. Non-sociopaths are filtered out. The political structure becomes a secret private club. So rather than say the political structure induces those behaviors, it is more accurate to say that it tests for those behaviors. The people that pass the tests are promoted, and those that fail the tests are steered out of the club.

Quote:
Dictators are not evil by definition, but many do share a particular set of unfortunate personality traits. They might harbour fantasies of unlimited power, beauty, glory, honour and domination, paired with a lack of empathy. “Probably, the job opening of dictator appeals to the nastier end of the range of our species, in particular, to narcissists” says Steven Pinker, a professor of psychology at Harvard University. -- source

Even Harvard psychologists oversimplify. Yes, the "job opening" of dictator does appeal to sociopaths, many of whom are narcissists as well, but the complex dynamics in play, like the whole manipulated political structure guided by a secret private club, ensure that only controllable club members are potential candidates for any "leadership" position. The dictator rules as a proxy for the private club that permitted his ascendance and who really pull the strings.

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Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:08 am
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First, to recognize them, keep the following guidelines in mind.

(1) They are habitual liars. They seem incapable of either knowing or telling the truth about anything.

(2) They are egotistical to the point of narcissism. They really believe they are set apart from the rest of humanity by some special grace.

(3) They scapegoat; they are incapable of either having the insight or willingness to accept responsibility for anything they do. Whatever the problem, it is always someone else's fault.

(4) They are remorselessly vindictive when thwarted or exposed.

(5) Genuine religious, moral, or other values play no part in their lives. They have no empathy for others and are capable of violence. Under older psychological terminology, they fall into the category of psychopath or sociopath, but unlike the typical psychopath, their behavior is masked by a superficial social facade.

If you have come into conflict with such a person or persons, do the following immediately!

(1) Notify your friends and relatives of what has happened.

Do not be vague. Name names, and specify dates and circumstances. Identify witnesses if possible and provide supporting documentation if any is available. -- source


Sociopaths cannot exercise their evil if their true character is exposed. They primarily manipulate by way of deception, and that becomes nearly impossible once sociopaths are publicly exposed. They also use threats of harm and ruin to manipulate, but their victims are numerous, and the sociopaths are few. Once sociopaths are exposed, the victims easily join forces against the now-identified perpetrators, and they quickly outnumber the sociopaths. The numerical superiority becomes decisive.

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Sat Jun 13, 2015 1:24 am
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Post Re: Sociopaths -- who knew?
Here's one we have seen over and over again when forum members have been exposed as sociopaths. Zook did it, Pod did it, and Andy did it.

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Another very valuable red flag to recognize when trying to spot a sociopath is to see how they deal with attacks on their own integrity. If a sociopath is presented with a collection of facts, documents and evidence showing that he lied or deceived, he will refuse to address the evidence and, instead, attack the messenger. -- source

And they typically attack their detractors (the messenger) by accusing them of their own malfeasance!

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Sat Jun 13, 2015 7:15 am
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